Resonance – Episode 20
Verbatim Transcript
Speaker: Viktoria Levenberg
Guest Speaker: Nathan James
Nathan James: We're so conditioned to be producing all the time.
Viktoria Levenberg: We all have the line, like where our stress bucket is overflowing, where we're
at maximum capacity. And like, why always force ourselves to get to that line?
Nathan James: Even if you had this perfect upbringing, the reality would remain that you still live
in a traumatised society, and there's trauma in the collective. I believe synchronicities are
happening constantly — we just aren't always paying attention to them.
Viktoria Levenberg: In this episode, I connect with Nathan, a personal development coach. He
also works a lot with root cause trauma therapy, and just an incredible human who has so much
wisdom to share, particularly around the ancient intelligence of the nervous system that really
evolves with the world around us and how it roots back to safety.
How we all have experienced some kind of trauma that, unless we work through, we truly cannot
step into the fullest expression of joy in our life. And he also distils how to find that way back
home to yourself. So tune in — I look forward to seeing you on the inside.
Viktoria Levenberg: Welcome to Resonance, a podcast for ambitious, heart-led humans craving
more balance, depth, and aliveness in their lives. I'm your host, Vik — health coach, yoga teacher,
facilitator, and fellow high achiever learning to live in tune with my nervous system, not against it.
This space is here to remind you that you can have it all — the career, the success, the fulfilment
— all aligned with your truth. Through honest conversations, expert insights, and practical tools,
we'll explore how to work with your body, mind, emotions, and spirit, not against them. And the
best part: you don't have to stay stuck in survival mode to get there.
Because true well-being is not about being perfect — it's about being in resonance. Let's dive in.
Viktoria Levenberg: Alright, so I'm gonna keep this short and sweet, because you will get the
backstory between Nathan and I in the episode. And honestly, he's just the most incredible
person, you know? Just one of those people where I was having like a pretty crappy, rushed
morning and I was running late. And if you know me, you know how I really don't like to run late
to things — it's like one of my biggest pet peeves.
And sort of, I kind of went through the door and there is Nathan — he was just like this most
incredible, smiley, kind human, and the whole trajectory of my day shifted. And this is what has
brought us to this episode here today.
So yeah, I'm just really excited for you to hear Nathan's story and the wisdom that he has to
share, and really just to stress that it is time. Like, things are changing in the world, in the planet,
in society, in the collective consciousness right now. And there is so much in this episode that is
going to be of value for you — to help you navigate the perhaps shaky external environment
around you.
Because as long as you can find your core inner stability, nothing outside of you can truly shake
you to your core. And if it does, you'll definitely bounce back quicker with the tools that he's got.
Alright, let's dive in.
Nathan James: Presence with someone else when you do a practice, meditation, or anything like
that — just so powerful.
Viktoria Levenberg: Yeah, it's that shared energy. And I think there's an actual, like, physics term
for it as well — that's called “spooky action at a distance,” where even if we're not physically right
next to each other, there's something that happens in the quantum field.
Which is why often, like, you know, people who host like live webinars or something — like, show
up live — because you're still gonna get a transmission.
Nathan James: 100%. I totally believe that. Yeah, hmm.
If your heart had a voice, what would it say?
Viktoria Levenberg: Mine said “love.”
Hmm. What did yours say?
Nathan James: Mine said “I love you.”
Yeah. Oh yeah. And it made me think about this — it made me think about how I know that I
have so much unexpressed love, like that's available. And I remembered this guy who I met last
year in this little town, and he had like a shop, he was selling food at like a little shop.
And when I bought my food and left, he said, “See you later, I love you.” And I was with someone
at the time who was a local, and they said, “Oh, he says that to everybody.” He just always — like,
no matter where you see him or who you are — he'll say, “I love you.”
And I remember just that, to me, that was like the most amazing thing. That you could just so
freely express this love — and it's like true unconditional love, right? As in, I don’t even know who
you are, but I love you, you know?
Viktoria Levenberg: I love that. And like even, you know, recently I've been playing with this
expression — like to my friends — not like the “ah love you,” but like “I love you.” Because it's
like, yeah, actually, there's such deep unconditional love. And like, why should that only be
reserved to one person or like family members, right?
Nathan James: Yeah, yeah. 100%. Yeah.
Viktoria Levenberg: And it's just so forever expansive.
It's funny you say that, because we were speaking about dogs earlier. I have hit record, by the
way. Piper, which is my partner's dog, just got a new orthopaedic bed yesterday — ‘cause she's
getting a little bit older, needs to be a bit more comfortable. And it's like this massive thing. And
so I just kind of like, I was like, see, it's like perfect for two dogs. And there's enough space in the
bed, and there's definitely more than enough space in my heart.
So it's just like, it just expands.
Nathan James: Yeah, I love that.
That is so — and it is. And that's the thing, you start to realise, don’t you, that it's infinite. That it
doesn’t matter how much love you give out — like, you don’t run out. There’s not like a supply
that you — oh, I’m running out of love today, I better stop loving so much. You know, that never
happens. It’s infinite.
And I think that’s also like a really powerful realisation when you can kind of sink into that.
Yeah, I love that.
Viktoria Levenberg: The better it gets is the better it gets.
Nathan James: Haha, yes.
Viktoria Levenberg: But thank you so much for joining me on Resonance. It is like such a cool
synchronicity how this came about, by the way. Like, okay, quick backstory — because I actually
think it's pretty cool.
I was running late to my chiropractor one day on my way to work, and then I walk into my
chiropractic office and like, here's this incredible, kind human who I just — I don't know — it just,
something clicked, you know? I think it was like literally that day we just started chatting.
You were telling me about yourself and your plans, and you know, something magical happens
when you meet a person that's on a similar wavelength to yourself — where the conversation
just flows effortlessly. And next thing you know, here you are as a guest on my podcast, which I'm
so, so grateful for.
So Nathan, why don't you tell me and our listeners a little bit about yourself — you know, who
you are, what you do, and a bit of your story.
Nathan James: Yeah, thank you so much. And just on our backstory as well, it's so amazing — it's
as amazing for me to be here with you on the other end. But it's interesting because, you know, I
believe synchronicities are happening constantly — we just aren't always paying attention to
them.
And I've been making such an effort in my life recently to be paying more attention to patterns
and signs and symbols and encounters and everything resonating together, right? And so
meeting you that day and finding ourselves here is just another example of that.
And also this belief that I have, which is that the present moment contains everything we need.
The present moment is the teacher. And so everything in the present moment has something for
you.
And so I’ve found, when I've been even in public — or you know, like the day I met you — I've
actually made more of an effort recently to try to talk more to people or communicate more with
whatever's going on around me. Because I think to myself, there’s something here for me. Like,
that’s happening in the present moment — there’s something here for me.
So I think it can be really easy for us sometimes to almost shrink ourselves away in moments and
kind of not make much of an effort to talk, or not really communicate, or not really engage that
much with the present moment. But when you actually start doing that, you realise that there’s
so much there for us.
And yeah, you and I could have just sort of been stuck in our own heads and not really making
that much of an effort to talk to each other. But because we did, we realised how much we had in
common and how aligned we were — and found ourselves here.
Viktoria Levenberg: I love that. We'll definitely come back to some of the things you mentioned
as well. I'm taking notes as you speak ‘cause there’s so much coming through.
Love it.
Nathan James: Amazing. Amazing, yeah. But yeah, I guess on the day that we met, we sort of just
connected about the fact that we both — I think maybe it started with like yoga.
Yoga is definitely something that's been a big part of my journey. And going to then study yoga
and meditation kind of triggered a lot of what I’m doing now, which is working primarily in
trauma therapy and personal development coaching, personal and spiritual development, I
would say.
And yeah, so I have an online business where I work with people one-on-one and also in groups.
Just basically bringing people back home to their bodies, helping people, guiding people as they
start to resolve trauma that’s in their lives.
And yeah, just basically offering myself as a guide to be able to support people on the journey
that they're on, wherever that is. And when I do personal development coaching, some of those
people come to me because they've got certain career goals that they want to work on, and
some people come because they have deep, sort of spiritual stuff that they need some help with.
So yeah, my intention is just to be available for what people might need at any point that they're
at.
Viktoria Levenberg: Yeah, yeah. Anything that's unfolding in the moment, right? And as you say,
that role of the guide is so important. I think, you know, if we trace it back thousands and
thousands of years, this was part of — an integral part of — a community.
And these days, I feel like what's been normalised is this nuclear kind of family unit, where
unfortunately, there tends to be a lot of isolation. And there isn't as much opportunity for this
space — as you say, that you create and hold — for whatever needs to unfold, to do so in the
moment.
Nathan James: Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Yeah, that’s so true. We’re quite disconnected. Well, we’re
quite disconnected, aren’t we? Like, we’re quite disconnected from — well, I guess it’s like the
illusion of disconnection, you know? That we’ve sort of forgotten about our bodies, and we’ve
forgotten about the environment, and ourselves, and the people around us.
Viktoria Levenberg: And it comes back to presence, like what you mentioned earlier. The only way
that disconnection can occur is if we're not present — if we're stuck in the past or projecting into
the future. And like you mentioned just then with our backstory, as soon as you tap into the
present, as soon as you’re like, “Okay, this person in front of me right here, right now — there’s
something here. Let me tap into that.” The connection just happens automatically, like you don’t
even have to try.
Nathan James: Hahaha, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Exactly. Being present is really easy when you actually
focus yourself on it.
Viktoria Levenberg: Yeah, exactly. And I do want to say — it’s also probably like a trained muscle,
right? Especially if someone doesn’t practice it at all or regularly. It takes time for it to be easy. It’s
simple, I would say, but definitely not always easy.
Nathan James: It’s a simple concept. You’re so right. You’re 100% right. It’s a simple concept, and
there’s so much simplicity in it. But yeah, there’s some work to be done, I think, to take ourselves
out of where we might have found ourselves in our modern environments and with our busy
minds — yeah, back into that presence. Yeah, for sure.
Viktoria Levenberg: Exactly. And that monkey brain tends to overcomplicate things. It doesn’t like
things that are simple. It dismisses them as not true, or kind of tries to add onto it. And yeah, it’s
just really, really magical how all of that unfolded.
And you mentioned earlier that you’ve also been paying attention more to signs and symbols and
things that are just showing up as you really foster and cultivate your presence in your day-to-day
life. I’d be really curious — what signs and symbols and things are kind of popping up in your field
right now? Just like, what’s up?
Nathan James: Yeah. No — well, like I said, I think it’s just this idea that everything is like a
synchronicity. Everything is part of this, you know, web of life or this grander intelligence that is
operating this situation that we're all in.
And so it’s just like noticing, how is life speaking to you? You know, this idea that we’re in
relationship with life — that life is not happening to us, life is happening for us, it’s happening
through us. We’re not separate from it — we’re part of it, you know? We’re not just aimlessly
floating down the river — we are the river. We’re part of the river.
This idea that there’s a communication, and that we are so reliant — you know, as humans and in
our modern world — we’re so reliant on verbal communication. We want words, and we want
speaking, we want answers to come through that way. But we have the ability to communicate in
so many different ways.
And so I believe that life is often communicating with us through things like signs or symbols. So
for example, a number that holds a lot of significance to me is repeating twos — so like 22, or
222. It’s just a significant number to me.
And so whenever I see repeating twos, I know that there’s — you know, sometimes I take it to
mean that I’m on the right path, or I’m going the right way. But usually, it’s just kind of —
sometimes I might be thinking about something in particular, and then I’ll see the number, and
that’s like a validation. I take that as a validation.
Another thing is butterflies. Like, I’ll see butterflies — either a picture of a butterfly or a real
butterfly, or someone will say something about a butterfly. And again, these are just things that
are significant to me. We all will have something different.
And I believe too that life will communicate to you in a language that you understand. Life’s not
gonna speak to me in Chinese, because I don’t understand Chinese. But it’s gonna speak to me in
a way that I understand. And the more we pay attention to it, the more we start to hear it —
we’re like, “Ah, I understand that,” or, “I see what you’re saying,” or, “I see how you’re kind of
guiding me.” Guiding me along the path.
So yes, the actual signs — like the numbers or the butterflies — for me personally, the meaning
behind that recently has been similar to what you spoke about when we first got on this call
today, about alignment with purpose or the reason for being.
And starting to feel — not urgency, necessarily — but a sense of, “It’s time.” Like, we need to start
doing the work. We really need to start. Things are accelerating, things are intensifying. I think
there’s a bit of a call to action.
Viktoria Levenberg: I love that, yeah.
Nathan James: So that’s maybe some of the messaging behind some of the symbols as well.
Viktoria Levenberg: Yes. Thank you for sharing that. And quite similarly to you, I’m also
developing my intuition and becoming more and more aware of the signs and symbols around
me. That’s why I often find it so curious to hear — like, what signs and symbols are showing up
for you?
Would you mind sharing what the number 222 or the number 2 means in numerology, if that’s
something you resonate with?
Nathan James: Yeah, so one of the meanings that resonates the most with me personally is the
relationship thing. So again, it’s this idea that, you know, we go from one, which is singular, and
the next number is two — which is then, obviously, now there’s two things.
And in order to have a relationship, the single has to split into two so that there’s something to
have a relationship with. Which, when you take that deeper into more spiritual or esoteric
beliefs, becomes the idea of the universe knowing itself.
In order to do so, we’ve come from a oneness, but we had to split into two, so that you could
see, you could know self. But to me, it’s more about the relationship — the relationship with self,
the relationship with life, the relationship with other people.
Even the relationship to things like — if I relate it to the type of work that I do — the relationship
we have with our trauma, the relationship we have with our pain. We are in relationship with our
pain. We’re in relationship to our past. We have a relationship to our identity — how we see
ourselves, what we think about ourselves.
And so I think it’s a really important question that I often pose to people I work with — what is
your relationship with yourself? What do you believe about yourself? How do you talk to
yourself? And how do you treat yourself?
Because that relationship — that sort of primary relationship — will start to inform all of the
other relationships that you form throughout your life.
So the number two, to me, is very much this idea of relationship — not necessarily just romantic
relationship, but relationship with life and everything around you.
Viktoria Levenberg: Yeah, thank you for sharing that. And I really find this — I’ve never heard
anyone talk about our relationship with life in the way that you’ve just shared it today. And I find
that — I don’t know what it is — but it just lands so strongly.
You know, even in the personal development industry, you hear people often talk about your
relationship with stress or your relationship with stress, or your relationship with your body, or
food, or money — but like no one actually really zooms out and goes, like, there’s actually a much
more grand relationship that you have with life.
And the metaphor you used of, you know, the river — I find is really powerful. And to that point
as well, I love the idea of the number two signifying this for you, both in a romantic and this
grandiose sense. Because it does — like, numbers hold power.
You know, people refer to them as angel numbers sometimes, but also our intention holds power
as well. So you spoke earlier about the fact that life will communicate to you in the way that you
will best understand.
And a funny little anecdote I have from one of my financial mentors, actually — she used to be a
feng shui consultant and once was consulting someone who wanted to attract a partner into her
life. And so, in feng shui, the idea is if that’s your intention, then have pairs of things — like two
pillows, two nightstands, etc. — so that you’re kind of putting in the invitation, that you’re
inviting the energy of another person into your life.
And because this person had just one of, you know, it all — the person misunderstood the
briefing. So what she did — don’t get me wrong, she found the partner, it was all great — but
what she’d done, she’s like, “What did you do?” She said, “I put pears everywhere.”
But she understood it as the fruit! So she had like pictures of pears, and little icons of pears, and
a pair of pillows. And I was just like, oh my gosh, that is so, so good — because it just shows it
works! It’s one way to do it, haha.
Nathan James: Yeah, hahaha, yeah. Oh, that’s so true. And like you said — that’s the power of
intention, right? Like, even though she misunderstood the brief, the intention was still there.
The intention was the same, yeah.
Viktoria Levenberg: Yes, yeah. And we are just creating our own reality. Yeah, we might not know
it, but we are — like, the narrator, and the director, and the producer of our very own show.
And I think you spoke to that earlier when you mentioned, you know, what is our relationship to
ourselves — that you speak to with your clients — and how do you speak to yourself? And I
would love for you, if you’re comfortable sharing, to maybe talk to how you got onto this path.
Because, yeah, I’ve got to say, working with trauma therapy — that is the path of a warrior, right?
Like, often, we ourselves have definitely gone through some fires that then have allowed us to
emerge as that phoenix rising, to help someone else.
Nathan James: Yeah, absolutely. And what a gift — to be able to say that you were able to do a
certain level of work on yourself that then enabled you to be of service to other people as well.
Yeah, I definitely — like all of us, right? Like, we all have trauma. Everybody does. Because even if
you had this perfect upbringing, and like, you know, the best parents in the world, and no trouble
along the way — the reality would remain that you still live in a traumatised society, and there’s
trauma in the collective.
So you know, obviously, we all have varying degrees of trauma, but we all have experience with
trauma. And I think there’s also a lot of misunderstanding about what trauma means in some
cases.
Because it’s easy to see how severe abuse can be trauma. It’s easy to see how, like, obviously
accidents can cause trauma. But the smallest things — an example that was always used during a
lot of the training that I did around trauma — was the idea of a child being left in the car while
the parent went into the…
Or a child falling asleep in the car and the parent quickly running inside to grab something. The
child waking up and noticing the parent was gone — and just absolutely losing it. And how
damaging that can be to the child that would believe it’s been abandoned, because it doesn’t
understand.
Obviously, the parent involved in that situation is doing something they believe is quite harmless,
and certainly shouldn’t feel terrible for doing that. But we don’t realise how it can be quite small
and insignificant-seeming things which can still have quite a heavy impact on us.
Yeah, I definitely — obviously, like all of us — have had my own experiences with trauma
throughout my life. I definitely had quite a challenging upbringing and developed a really
unhealthy relationship with myself growing up.
So speaking of relationships with self, I had a really unhealthy relationship with myself because
when I was a child, I was really overweight. So a huge coping mechanism of mine was food. That
was my first drug of choice.
And then, yeah — going throughout, one of the main things that I would have dealt with growing
up was this feeling of being really unsafe. My home and family environment was somewhat
unpredictable.
And so, you know, in a developing nervous system, the home environment being unpredictable
like that is going to trigger a lot of stress and concern for safety. Even though my life was never in
danger, the unpredictability —
Viktoria Levenberg: You didn’t know that? Yeah.
Nathan James: Yeah, yeah, yeah. In high school, I was really bullied throughout school and really
struggled with that. So then now the external environment — in this case being the school
outside of home — has also become an unsafe environment to be in.
And yeah, so sort of moving through that, coming into early adulthood, I went like 100 miles an
hour in the other way. So I just went super positive. I was convinced that if I could just be positive
and pretend that everything in my life was really good…
Viktoria Levenberg: You know what my business coach calls that? It’s “whipped cream on
garbage,” hahaha.
Viktoria Levenberg: Yeah, okay. Quick pause — let’s just take a brief moment to take a deep
breath in through the nose… and out through the mouth.
Hmm. How yummy is that? Hey, if mindfulness has ever felt confusing or too hard to start — I
created a free online course called Live in Presence: 8 Days of Mindfulness to help you come back
to yourself gently.
You can sign up for free using the link in the show notes below at lvnhealth.co or through the link
in my bio at LVNHealth.
Now take a deep breath in — and we’ll gently transition back to the episode.
Nathan James: That’s what it was like. And yeah, and then realising later in life — and it was
realising it through my relationships — that I had so much unhealed stuff from my past, and that I
was really disconnected from my body.
Because what I didn’t realise when I was doing it as a young person, obviously, was that things
like the eating — which then later on turned into starting to abuse other substances as well — it
was an attempt to numb.
You know, it was numbing the body, numbing the experience. And to just take myself fully out of
that unpleasant experience that I was having, and to not want to feel, and to not want to deal
with it.
I also have a long line of addiction throughout my dad’s side of the family, and so I think the path
was carved really easily for me to walk down that.
But again, sort of that realisation eventually that — ah, I’ve got all this unresolved trauma that
not only I need to resolve in my mind, resolve within the stories that I have about my life and
about myself, but that is also in my body.
And yeah, and so I sort of began the path to try to unravel that, understand that a little bit. And it
was through my relationships that I discovered that, because I was causing so many problems in
my romantic relationship at the time.
And then the realisation being, “Oh — I’m doing this because it’s the trauma. It’s the pain.” It’s
the pain that’s causing this.
And so it just led me down a path, and it and it just led me down a path — and it initially led me
down the path of more conventional things, like therapy, like just conventional talk therapy.
Early, sort of in my twenties, I was using prescription antidepressant medication — so, you know,
more of what we conventionally believe is the answer.
But eventually I knew — like, I wasn’t able to go deep enough. I knew there was something
deeper.
Viktoria Levenberg: That was just like a knowing in you? Or did that come through, like, someone
in your life? Or did you just feel that in you?
Nathan James: I think I just felt it. I just — yeah, I was like, “We’re not going deep enough. I need
to go stronger, deeper than that.”
And so I then started to experiment, or just try — just start to look, right? You just start trying
different things, talking to different people.
Yeah, and it eventually — I’ve just met and worked with some incredible healers and therapists
and practitioners. And yeah, I was just able to really start to resolve — first within my mind, but
then more deeply within my body, and become more able to gain perspective of a bigger picture,
a deeper understanding.
Yeah, and then eventually I think you get to the point where you realise — oh, like, I still am on
my own journey, and that journey will continue. But it’s time for me to now start to guide — like,
bring other people.
Viktoria Levenberg: Yeah.
Nathan James: You know, guide other people along. And the sense of — not responsibility,
because that’s the wrong word, it doesn’t feel like a heavy responsibility — but this almost… you
know, like, “Ah, I really should.” I really should do this. This is something that I can do, and I really
should be of service to other people.
So yeah, that’s sort of what led me to where I am now.
Viktoria Levenberg: Thank you for sharing that. And just — you know, wow, to hear your journey.
And the reason I kind of probed earlier around whether it was someone or something that
prompted you versus your inner knowing, is just — I feel that it takes so much inner connection
and awareness with oneself to be able to listen to that knowing.
Because, in my personal experience, and in a lot of people who I know, it often takes a couple of
blows from life to really kind of slap you in the right direction, hahaha.
But you really kind of had that centredness and groundedness within you.
And yeah, to your point around — once you work through so much of your own healing, and yes,
that journey is never-ending, right? It’s gonna continue. But as you say, it’s almost like a
reciprocity.
It’s sort of like — you’ve received, you’ve received, you’ve received. And now it’s time to give
back to someone who’s maybe in your shoes — just a step behind, or ten steps behind. Like, it
doesn’t really matter. Because we all need way-showers in life.
And the fact that you have chosen to go down this path is really inspiring.
And I would really love to dive into some of the — yeah, I’m really curious to hear about root
cause therapy. Because you spoke to safety, and that is so true, right?
Like, at the end of the day, if we don’t feel safe — if our nervous system is dysregulated — it’s
gonna be really hard for us to function with just even the most basic life tasks.
And you mentioned the unpredictability of the environment, which was quite dysregulating.
I felt really called to weave in this random study that I heard about, which was — I don’t know,
you might be familiar with it — you know, the monkey study? Where they had like three groups
of monkeys?
So basically, they did this study on monkeys where they had three separate groups. And I think
one was a unit where they had all the food, all the abundance, everything they needed.
Another one — they were basically starving, they had very little to go with for survival. And then
they had a third group, where some days they would have so much abundance, and then other
days it would just be like nothing.
And it was just quite unpredictable. And the interesting thing is that the group that had a lot of
food — like, they thrived, they had a great life, and they were just, you know, good.
And also the group that had little also thrived, and they were well as well.
It was the group that had the unpredictable up-and-down cycle of “lots-little, lots-little” that
absolutely lost the plot.
And I think they had to stop the study early because it was just — yeah, it was not safe to
continue.
So that’s just kind of a really nice real-life example of how we do need safety and stability in order
to function — from a primal, instinctual level.
Nathan James: Yeah, that’s so interesting. I love that story. And it’s interesting because — from
what you just said at the end, from the primal and instinctual level — that is just what the body is
designed for.
It’s just how the body vessel runs.
But when we start to dig deeper into some of our practices — our meditation practice, any of our
spiritual practice — it’s, “How can we start to build resilience? How can we start to build this
sense of internal stability?”
So that when the external environment becomes unstable — in fact, the external environment is
always unstable, because it’s subject to change.
Change is the only thing that there is, you know? It’s an illusion that everything is staying the
same.
So, how can we build this inner resilience and this inner level of stability so that we’re not so
reliant on the external environment being stable all the time? Because it simply won’t be.
But to your point, we also have to realise that we have a body. We’ve been given a body, and
that’s what we’re driving around in.
And the body has a nervous system. And the nervous system in the body — which is just infinitely
intelligent — it wants safety, it wants stability.
And it’s going to experience the instability of the external environment as unpleasant, like in the
study with the monkeys.
So yeah, I think that’s so interesting. And again, that’s a relationship, right? It’s a relationship.
It’s first of all a relationship with the body vessel. It’s also a relationship between the body, the
external environment, and our internal environment.
Because you could have the most peaceful, stable, and predictable life — and if you had a chaotic
internal environment, your mind was just completely chaotic, everything was a total shambles on
the inside — then it doesn’t matter how stable the external environment becomes.
You won’t feel stable. You won’t be stable, you know?
Viktoria Levenberg: Yeah.
Nathan James: And vice versa. You know, so if that’s true, then technically — if it doesn’t matter
how unstable the external environment is, how chaotic it is, how unpredictable it is all the time
— if we can start to cultivate a more stable inner experience, then that’s gonna have an effect as
well.
So again, it’s just that relationship with those moving parts.
Viktoria Levenberg: Yeah, yeah. And you mentioned earlier the piece around change. My very
first yoga teacher, when I was eight years old, said that change is the only constant in our lives.
And that sentence has stuck with me throughout my entire life.
And as you say — the blows in life will keep… like, it’s just gonna keep on coming. There is an
unstable external environment.
And like we were chatting just before we started recording, right? Like, whoo — this week’s been
a wild one.
And I really was reflecting on the experience. I was even joking with my partner, who’s not really
into all this health and wellness and spirituality stuff at all — but you know, I am, so he kind of
gets it.
And we were joking how I was like, “Damn, me a few years ago would have just gone to vapes
and alcohol and just numbed out.”
Like, it’s so much harder to feel all this stuff, hahaha.
But then it also helps you get through it faster. Because if we’d revert back to the old ways, it
would just stay stuck, and keep on rotting us from the inside.
Versus, as you say, cultivating that inner stillness, that inner awareness, that inner presence — to
be able to deal with the environment when it starts to get shaky, when the ground starts to open
up underneath you.
Nathan James: And that takes a lot of work, right? It was so much easier to numb out.
Viktoria Levenberg: It was so much easier.
It was so much easier.
Nathan James: Oh God, you know… But yeah —
Viktoria Levenberg: Oh, memories.
Nathan James: But yeah. But when we numb ourselves to — as you know — when we numb
ourselves to the experience, to things we don’t want to feel when we numb ourselves to the
experience, to things we don’t want to feel, we also numb ourselves — you just numb yourself to
everything. The numbing is a blanket effect, you know?
So we might not be feeling the things that are making us feel uncomfortable, but we’re also
numbing the things that bring us joy and love — the things that we wanted to have more of in
our lives.
Viktoria Levenberg: Mmm-hmm.
Nathan James: So yeah — and it is, you know, the thing about change is that even though it’s
really terrifying to the mind — it’s the mind that struggles with change. This idea that things will
fluctuate and shift, the mind wants things to be predictable.
The mind wants to be able to predict, it wants to know what’s gonna happen. So this idea that
things change all the time sounds really terrifying, but it’s also incredibly liberating — to know
that things are gonna change.
Because it reminds us, when we’re going through a really challenging time — hey, this is gonna
change. This isn’t gonna be forever, because nothing is forever.
You know, when I wake up in the morning and I might feel uncomfortable, or a way that’s not
super desirable — the good news is, it will change. Because everything does. Nothing is
permanent.
So the idea that things will change is actually really liberating.
And I think if we then go sort of deeper still into the nervous system stuff — what the body does
know, is that the body knows change.
The body knows change on the level that the body is a part of the earth, right? The body is of the
earth.
The body knows how to be connected to the natural cycles of the earth. It understands, it’s
communicating with the earth, it’s communicating with the environment.
And so the body does know change — because it knows cycles, it knows movement. And again,
this idea that the planet is alive and is going through cycles and changing all the time — the body
understands that.
But I think that we, again, in our modern world, which has disconnected us from the earth, and
our connection to our bodies —
Viktoria Levenberg: In our bodies?
Nathan James: Yeah. Even though the modern world has — you know, we can’t be disconnected
from something that we’re inseparable from — but it’s created this idea of disconnection.
We’ve been physically pulled away from the earth.
Viktoria Levenberg: We’re boxed up in rooms that keep us away from sunlight, water, earth — the
elements.
Nathan James: Yeah, yeah, 100%.
We’re put in these boxes, we’re away from the ground, there’s artificial light, constant
stimulation.
Viktoria Levenberg: We’re eating artificial foods, drinking artificial drinks — poison.
Nathan James: Yeah, 100%.
And so it’s interesting that the conversation has come here, because when we’re talking about
the nervous system and this idea that — a lot of the work I’m doing now is starting to push more
toward this idea that we have this ancient nervous system.
It’s an ancient intelligence that has been evolving with the planet, with life. But we’ve taken it out
of its environment — and it’s suffering.
Like, the body and the nervous system are suffering because we’ve — it’s like, when you… it’s like
your cell phone, right?
The phone will easily be disconnected from the power and run for a little while, but eventually,
you’re gonna have to plug it back into the power cord, because it’s gonna die.
And that’s what’s happening to our bodies, you know? We’re so disconnected from the power
source that we’re suffering and struggling.
And so we really have to find a way to come back into the body. And as we come back into the
body, I think it almost starts to happen naturally.
And you may have seen it in yourself or in your work as well — that we actually start to gravitate,
without even being told, we just start to gravitate back to the earth.
We want to spend more time in nature. We want to go to the beach, we want to go for a
bushwalk, we want to get sunlight, we want fresh air.
We start to question the food and the water, and, you know, we just come back into the body.
And we naturally start to bring ourselves back into some kind of cycle and rhythm — even if we
don’t know we’re doing it.
Viktoria Levenberg: Yes, yes — that is so spot on. And my goodness, you’ve touched on so much
gold here.
Because as you say, we are cyclical beings — both men and women. And especially, you know,
something that came to me as well — women are suppressing their cycles with the hormonal
birth control pill.
So even that is another way where the body’s being pulled out of its natural rhythm, because the
natural hormonal production isn’t happening.
It’s also quite a strong example there, and absolutely — the other piece that you mentioned that
I really wanted to touch back on as well is that — like, how good you can feel, but you can’t feel it
unless you also feel the badness.
Right? And one of my meditation and manifestation teachers talks about this — that like, how
can we expect to feel the most ultimate bliss, to live the life of our wildest dreams, if we’re not
ready and willing to also feel the rage, to feel the sorrow — both ours, our ancestors’, the
collective, those who maybe don’t feel safe enough to feel theirs. Right?
It’s sort of — you can’t just have one. I think as you say, it’s a spectrum. And I don’t know about
you, but like, back in my numbing days, I was very apathetic — like, I would just be a robot. I
wouldn’t feel at all.
And gradually your spectrum grows. It’s like, the more pain you allow yourself to experience, the
more you actually also realise how much joy and bliss is out there and available to you.
And it’s up to you how wide of a spectrum you are able to expand your capacity to hold.
I think that’s kind of a really miraculous way that we get to experience this life in this body.
Nathan James: 100%. And I had a really beautiful healing experience once where I felt so
connected to the idea that you just said, which is that it’s like polarity, right?
Everything has an equal and opposite. And so your capacity for pain will be mirrored by your
capacity for pleasure, for life.
And for me, it was this really visceral experience of the pain that I was holding in my body and in
my energy — it was stretching me out, so that I could actually hold more light.
You know, more love, and more of those good things as well.
We are multidimensional beings, and we have this capacity to experience a kaleidoscope of
feelings.
We are feeling creatures — the body is a feeling machine. That’s part of its job — it’s a feeling
device.
And so I think it’s just the conditioning that we’ve all gone through, which tells us, “These are the
things that you should feel and want to feel,” and “These are the things that you shouldn’t feel or
don’t want to feel.”
So we almost need to adjust that mindset a little bit to say, actually — I just want to feel. And I
have the capacity to feel so many different things.
And all feelings are okay. All feelings are okay, and all feelings are valid.
Viktoria Levenberg: That’s it, that’s it. Like, anger is no better than joy, is no better than sorrow.
You’ll probably resonate with this, right? Women often apologise for crying. Men have a really
challenging time displaying their sorrow in public — at least from kind of the men I’ve interacted
with.
And it’s like, it’s all just being stuck in there.
So a practice that I — and I actually would encourage anyone listening to do this as well — if
someone actually has the courage to show their emotions, to be vulnerable, and to let even a
sliver of emotion be there — to encourage that.
To name it and say, “Hey, thank you for your courage and for showing your emotion, for feeling
your feelings.”
Because I think, as you say, we’ve been conditioned in a society that glorifies joy and producing
and always being happy all the time.
And, you know, we’re told by our parents, “Stop crying or I’ll give you something to cry about,”
whatever.
And yet if we start to rewire that patterning — that neurological, that nervous system imprint —
we can start to make it feel okay and safe to finally show our feelings again.
And thereby, make more joy accessible to more humans as well.
Nathan James: That’s so true. That’s so true. I love that.
Viktoria Levenberg: And I — as soon as you spoke to this earlier, immediately was like, “I want to
know what you’re doing.”
So, you used this analogy earlier of our phone and how, you know, your phone can run on its
battery for a little bit, and then you gotta plug it back in.
And I would love to hear how you plug back in.
We take that analogy — like, what do you do?
Nathan James: I love it. Thank you. Yeah, um — look, for me it definitely is about just being out
there, and literally having physical contact with the environment, you know?
I also am — so we spoke about astrology when we first called today, and I have a lot of air in my
chart. And so I’m naturally quite ungrounded.
I feel like I have to work quite hard to be a little bit more grounded.
So for me it’s really just about going to the ground. I love just putting my feet in the grass or the
sand at the beach. I actually love walking around barefoot in general.
And I really believe — and this is where I start to get, like, a little bit — the hippie side of me
comes out, but I really believe that — like I said earlier — that your body knows how to
communicate with the environment.
And one of the ways that it can do that is by making physical contact with the environment, you
know?
So walking around barefoot, as our ancestors would have done, it’s actually a way that the body
can be in communication with the world around it.
The body can be in communication with the world around it in many ways, obviously, but that’s
one of them.
And so often, if I go to the beach or if I walk around barefoot somewhere, I’ll make a real note to
breathe and meditate — because I think, what a great opportunity to be plugged in and to be
seeing what comes through, and to be receiving as well.
So that’s a really big one for me.
Anything related to breath is really grounding to me, because it pulls me back out of my mind.
So any number of different breathing techniques — even if it’s literally just stopping to ask
myself, “How am I breathing? What’s going on with my breath right now?” and starting to make
the breath a little bit more conscious.
Being in the sunlight, I find, really — yeah, it just puts me back in my body, and it’s also really
grounding.
And this is something that I encourage all of my clients to do when we’re doing any kind of body
work and starting to bring awareness to that connection with the body.
It’s actually just to stop and ask, “How does my body feel right now?”
That’s it, you know? And that can be so grounding — just to actually say, “What’s going on in my
body right now? How does it feel? Are there any little aches or pains or bits of discomfort? What
does my body need from me?”
And so I find that quite grounding and recharging as well.
And you know, rest — I just love to rest. I honestly…
Viktoria Levenberg: I love that.
Nathan James: We’re so conditioned to be producing all the time, working all the time,
constantly doing.
Viktoria Levenberg: Tell me about it.
Nathan James: And you see it so often when you look at trauma responses, right? This idea that
you have to constantly be doing.
For many people, it’s really common to not even be able to sit down and rest, because there’s
this urgency that something needs to get done, something requires my attention. Something…
Viktoria Levenberg: That runs in my ancestry, my friend.
Nathan James: Yeah, it’s such a huge one, right? And so that can be — it’s part of our social
conditioning, obviously — but it can also be a trauma response.
That you don’t feel safe, so you have to be alert all the time, hypervigilant, and doing something.
So again, doing a lot of this inner work, I think, is about being able to rest without feeling guilty —
being able to feel safe to rest, to know that it’s okay to rest.
And again, to realise this relationship with the body.
The body can’t just keep going forever. It is incredibly resilient, and you will be able to push your
body really, really far — but eventually your body is gonna stop. It’s gonna say, “No.”
And I think it’s really important that we don’t push ourselves that far, that we let it rest, that we
let it sleep, and that we let it lay around.
You know, when you travel and go to countries — especially where there are a lot of Indigenous
people, or people who are living quite simply — they’re rich. They chill out. They’re hanging out.
Yes, there’s work to be done, but life is just like, “Yeah, man, we just do what we need to do.”
There’s just a whole different kind of pace.
And yeah, in the West, we’re pretty far from that.
Viktoria Levenberg: Yes, I love that you named that, because as you say, the body will be
incredibly resilient.
And it’ll send you little signals, and you have the choice of listening to those signals — or you can
push through, but it will stop you.
Because we all have the line — where our stress bucket is overflowing, where we’re at maximum
capacity.
And like, why always force ourselves to get to that line?
Why not just proactively make sure that our rest and happiness bucket is overflowing, so that
we’re emptying out the stress and filling in the good?
Nathan James: Yeah, absolutely.
Viktoria Levenberg: Thank you for sharing that. I love how you called the body a healing machine
— that was a really cool way to phrase it, because it is. It’s literally what it’s designed to do, as
long as it’s put in the right circumstances and given the right care, love, and attention — both
within and without.
And sometimes, as you say, you don’t need any fancy equipment or techniques. Just ask yourself,
“How is my body feeling? How is my mind? What are my emotions like? What’s my energy like?”
And without judgment, without expectation, without trying to change anything — just letting
that be.
It’s so synchronistic that you mentioned that earlier, because I was teaching a yoga class this
morning, and that’s literally how I started and finished the practice.
Nathan James: That’s amazing, that’s amazing.
We have a lot of synchronicities — because you actually shared something on Instagram about
values, a quote that you had about values.
And I’ve just finished putting together a workbook around the idea of how to identify your values,
and what it means to have values that you use as a compass to take authentic action.
Viktoria Levenberg: Oh my God.
Nathan James: — and so when I saw your post, I was like, “Oh God, we’re so aligned.”
Viktoria Levenberg: That’s so magical.
Nathan James: I love it.
Viktoria Levenberg: And you mentioned earlier that you have a lot of air in your chart — I was
actually really curious, super random, but whether you know your dosha from Ayurveda?
Nathan James: Ah, I haven’t done it in a long time. I actually did a course in Ayurveda many years
ago, and I need to update myself.
But I was very — like, at that time, very Pitta–Pitta, because I’ve always had a lot of fire. So it’s
always quite strong pressure.
But that’s really softened a lot throughout, like, the last sort of ten years of my life.
So I would imagine, just off the top of my head, that I’d be a lot more Vata now. Yeah. What
about you?
Viktoria Levenberg: Which is interesting, because I haven’t had it formally done — the best way is
with an Ayurvedic practitioner, which I haven’t done — but just from my readings and
understanding, I’m 99.9% through and through a Vata.
Which is kind of the other thing that came up when you said you have a lot of air — I was like,
“Oh yeah, tell me about it.” Air and space, baby.
Air and space, hahaha.
So on days like these — I don’t know what it’s like for you, but it’s windy as hell outside — I’m
just like, “Oh my God, stop!”
Nathan James: Yeah, I find windy days really activating — like, I’ll be quite energised.
Viktoria Levenberg: Oh really? I’ll just be, like, really discombobulated and just feel it.
Nathan James: Yeah, yeah, yeah — that’s so interesting.
Viktoria Levenberg: Well, I have one final signature question for you that I ask every guest on the
podcast.
If there was one thing from our conversation today that you’d want to resonate with listeners
long after the episode ends — what would that be?
Nathan James: I think for me, it has to be what we’ve spoken about in terms of our connection to
life and to the world — to the earth, to nature.
It’s just such a reminder for all of us that we are not just connected to these things — we are one
within.
We are part of life.
And now more than ever, you turn on the news and things seem not great — and what’s
happening externally is being reflected internally.
There’s a lot of inner turmoil that people are experiencing.
So for all of us to remember that we are here as one with everything else, and we have so much
to gain — so much healing available to us — if we can bring ourselves back into the body, bring
ourselves back into sync, back into the ground, and really just come back into being.
I think it’s so powerful to do that.
You charge your phone every night — or whenever you charge your phone — but you do it every
day, right?
And so we need to treat ourselves how we treat our phones — and just plug back in.
Viktoria Levenberg: Really, really wise words. And just starting there will already unlock quantum
leaps for anyone.
Nathan James: Absolutely.
Viktoria Levenberg: Yeah. And how can people work with you? If people want to learn more
about you, where can they find you? Tell us.
Nathan James: Yeah, thank you. Well, I have a website — awakenwithnathan.com — that’s also
my Instagram username.
I offer different trauma therapy services, personal development coaching, and I do a lot of
meditation—I have an upcoming meditation workshop for anyone who’s listening — if you’re in
Auckland, you can come to my meditation workshop at the end of September.
And yeah, you can literally just message me anytime. I’m a big fan of, you know, person-to-person
connection.
If you have questions, if you just want to know anything, or you just want to chat — yeah, you
can message me on Instagram or send me a message via my website.
Viktoria Levenberg: Amazing. And anytime I speak to you, I just get an instant frequency upgrade.
So I highly recommend anyone listening — just jump on Instagram, send him a DM. He’s like
sunshine in human form.
Nathan James: Thank you — right back at you, right back at you.
Viktoria Levenberg: Thank you. Thank you so, so much for coming on. My goodness, there’s so
much juice and wisdom in the conversation that unfolded today. I’m incredibly grateful for you
sharing your story, your wisdom, and your reflections.
And yeah — I know our paths will cross many times, as they do. But in the meantime, I just hope
you have an incredible workshop in a couple of weeks, and I look forward to seeing what’s next
for us.
Nathan James: Thank you so much, Vik. I’m so grateful to be here with you — not just on this
podcast, but in life.
And thank you for this beautiful work that you’re doing and offering to the world. Sending you so
much love.
Viktoria Levenberg: This episode was so juicy. I hope you enjoyed it as much as I did.
Some of my key insights and reflections are this analogy that — you know, we are not just
floating along on this river of life. We are the river. We are part of this river.
Every single one of us plays a really important role. And at the end of the day, the core essence of
any work that we do in our own healing journey all comes back down to safety.
Because if we don’t feel safe, there’s no way we’ll ever actualise our full potential that we came
onto this planet with.
You know, I have personally — and we didn’t get a chance to dive into this in the episode, but I
thought it was important to name it now — I’ve worked with people, and spoken to people, who
are, you know, the lucky few who have had a really great childhood and don’t fall into what
society would call “the trauma brackets” in their life.
They’re like, “I think I’m fine, nothing happened, I’m good.”
And what I always say — whether it’s to those clients, or my friends, or in any context — is that,
at the end of the day, it’s not about what actually happened.
We all have our own reality and perception of our lived experience.
Even if, in the grand scheme of things, you didn’t have what would be considered high-level
trauma — say you have a low ACE score, that doesn’t mean you didn’t experience trauma.
It just means you have a different baseline. Your nervous system is operating from a different set
point.
And at the same time, if you were that baby who fell asleep and woke up, and your parent wasn’t
there — because they ran into the grocery store to get some milk and didn’t want to wake you
up, out of love and great intention — that’s still dysregulating.
So I just really wanted to name that, because anyone listening who’s thinking, “Oh, my life was all
rosy, everything’s great” — well, the thing is, everything’s great in the context of your lived
experience.
If something really shook you to your core and you feel like it’s not “big enough” or “worthy,” or
that kind of negative self-talk creeps in — please scrap that completely.
Because no one has walked even a step in your shoes, no one can speak to your lived experience
except for you.
And I clearly got quite fired up about this, but that’s probably because someone out there
needed to hear it.
So with that in mind, as we wrap the episode, my invitation for you, as your call to action this
week, is to ponder how you plug back in.
Whether it’s plugging back into the earth, to Source, to yourself — how do you recharge
yourself?
And be honest with yourself. How often do you do that? And can you do it a little bit more this
week?
That’s all from me for now. I hope you have a beautiful week ahead. Lots of love — bye.
Viktoria Levenberg: If you’re enjoying this episode and want to stay connected beyond the
podcast, I would love to invite you to join my newsletter.
It’s a soft little pause in your inbox — an email that you actually want to read — sharing
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The link is right below in the show notes — you can sign up through my website, lvnhealth.co, or
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It’s free, it’s gentle, and it’s always created with care.
Viktoria Levenberg: The views and opinions expressed by guests on Resonance are their own and
do not necessarily reflect the views of me, Viktoria Levenberg, LVNHealth, or anyone working
within the LVNHealth brand.
This space welcomes a diversity of ideas, experiences, and stories. Part of Resonance is learning
to take what aligns and gently leave the rest.
Also, while I am a National Board Certified Health and Wellness Coach and deeply passionate
about wellbeing, this podcast is intended for educational and inspirational purposes only.
Resonance does not substitute personalised medical, psychological, or therapeutic advice. Always
seek guidance from qualified professionals for any physical, emotional, or mental health
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